Here Comes the Sun

I really hate to quote The Beatles or Paul Krugman because they are way above my level, but I feel compelled to get out the word concerning a power source which would make me feel less guilty about using power.

Krugman’s genius is his economic use of words and I can distill his message in this piece down to one sentence:

we’re just a few years from the point at which electricity from solar panels becomes cheaper than electricity generated by burning coal.

And now, the song:

  1. #1 by Larry Bergan on November 7, 2011 - 8:35 pm

    I have one beef with the video. They spelled Ringo’s name wrong.

  2. #2 by Shane on November 8, 2011 - 6:38 am

    Imagine if we had actually spent R&D money on solar…

  3. #3 by Richard Warnick on November 8, 2011 - 12:46 pm

    Chicago – “Wake Up Sunshine”

  4. #4 by brewski on November 8, 2011 - 1:08 pm

    Imagine if we actually taxed negative externalities.

  5. #5 by Larry Bergan on November 8, 2011 - 2:32 pm

    Some in our society say that solar power is a nonviable source of power but they have their agenda. It’s just good to hear it from Krugman because you can take it to the bank.

    Everybody is ignoring the horror of what the nuclear plant in Japan has wrought, but I’ve heard there is a huge increase in infant deaths on the west coast of the United States. It is unconscionable that we haven’t been working on the solar route to solve our energy problems.

    Richard:

    I absolutely love that Chicago album. When it first came out it was sold for the same price as a single album for some reason, but there isn’t a bad song on it!

  6. #6 by Shane on November 8, 2011 - 2:43 pm

    Thank god warming isn’t real and oil and coal will never run out, so this remains a solution in need of a problem.

    http://m.ucsusa.org/global_warming/science_and_impacts/impacts/impacts-of-climate-on-coffee.html

  7. #7 by San Juan Bautista on November 8, 2011 - 6:43 pm

    Well Richard, over here on this site I am not writing any denialist claims. I just mean to tell you that the coal trains leaving the Peabody mine here are so numerous, and so loaded that there is absolutely no intention to change a thing. That is reality. What is denialist is to think that somehow this resource is not going to be mined until it is gone, and that is going to take several hundred years at the rate it is being mined. The reserves are quite massive, one has to see it to believe it.

    The Germans have more solar than anyone per capita, but in light of their closing their nuke plants down, they are going back to burning coal, lignite (dirty brown coal) of which they have vast domestic reserves. Whatever it is you are claiming is going to change is belied by the reality of ever increasing coal contracts and associated mining operations being put into service. Just the way it is at the moment.

  8. #8 by San Juan Bautista on November 9, 2011 - 11:29 am

    With regard to AGW, this sums it up well..why is it that some persist and still believe in it?

    “in the sciences the authority of thousands of opinions is not worth as much as one tiny spark of reason in an individual man”.

    He would have known.

    Galileo Galilei

  9. #9 by Shane Smith on November 9, 2011 - 12:41 pm

    He would.

    And he proved his spark of reason by showing how easily repeatable his work was.

    As have the climate scientists. And each time the work is done we find it is basically correct, or slightly opptemistic in its downplay of the seriousness of the issue.

    And each time, nameless faceless cowards who can’t reason come out to champion debunked papers and talk about how the inversion disproves basic science. Try reason, it has worked pretty well so far for science.

    At this point, anyone who wants to tell us warming is not real or mostly human driven has to explain why it is that the vast majority of chemistry, physics, and systems theory should be changed to match their view. Good luck with that…

  10. #10 by San Juan Bautista on November 9, 2011 - 12:51 pm

    Crying shame isn’t it? That is irony of the AGW cult, there is no way to do that…, face it, you have entered the realm of faith and are now a cultist.

    “or mostly human driven” … good luck with that.

    You can’t even keep your shit straight.

  11. #11 by Larry Bergan on November 9, 2011 - 5:54 pm

    Thousands of people surrounded The White House to show their disapproval of the proposed oil pipeline from Canada just the other day, but there is no media coverage.

    Typical, but the people are winning without them:

    – Victory in Ohio: the Walker-like attack on collective bargaining was resoundingly defeated.

    – Victory in Maine: the voter suppression tactic of eliminating same-day registration failed by a 20 percent margin.

    – Victory in Mississippi: voters stood up for women and reproductive justice and said no to the “personhood” amendment.

  12. #12 by Richard Warnick on November 10, 2011 - 9:01 am

    The good news is, 12,000 people surrounding the White House got a result. Bad news: the result they got was President Obama postponed the approval of the Keystone XL Pipeline until after next year’s election, while the State Department goes through the motions of an “investigation.”

  13. #13 by San Juan Bautista on November 10, 2011 - 9:19 am

    Millions of people pumped gas into their car tanks yesterday, you might have been one of them. It is going to be passed. What pray tell are you going to run your cars on? Who has changed their ways?

    More absolute proof that man made CO2 AGW is not even a trifle on the environmental radar, oil from tar sands being the most CO2 intensive fuel to produce. More oil in the Alberta tar sands than Saudi, and Saskatchewan has at least as much and hasn’t touched an acre of it yet. The pipeline is mandatory, there will be no stopping it, along the way it will pick up North Dakota oil, and alleviate the train and trucking pressure of oil transport. All good.

    This under a progressive president. Washed and hung out dry is the progressive movement.

    Larry, the Ohio vote will be challenged in federal court, the civil war is on.

  14. #14 by Shane Smith on November 10, 2011 - 10:21 am

    Great conservative mindset, “it is happening now, qed it will never change.”

    If every human had been conservative, we would still be living in caves, fighting over whether or not we should use this new fangled “fire” stuff…

    …and Glenn would bitching that leaving the trees for the caves was a bad move.

    Ever forward!

  15. #15 by San Juan Bautista on November 10, 2011 - 11:28 am

    What are you doing about it Shane? Making yourself feel better? Absolutely nothing significant. Your share of the fuel will be burned, you drag your garbage can out to the curb like the rest of modern humanity.

    What is making a chain around the White House going to do? Pretty sure the whole lot of them got there in a car or some burning conveyance.

    The fact is Shane, and belied by your nonsense, is the like of you would have been opposed to fire with the sentiments you have. The pipeline is serving your de facto reality, get over it. Going to be built by Canadians, a socialist group promoting in earnest all the alternatives in the world, social, industrial, medical…yet they are the ones dragging the tar sands, making masses of carbon, and now building the pipeline so you can drive around.

    What’s that smell?

  16. #16 by San Juan Bautista on November 10, 2011 - 11:42 am

    What are you doing about it Shane? Making yourself feel better? Absolutely nothing significant. Your share of the fuel will be burned, you drag your garbage can out to the curb like the rest of modern humanity.

    What is making a chain around the White House going to do? Pretty sure the whole lot of them got there in a car or some burning conveyance.

    The fact is Shane, and belied by your nonsense, is the like of you would have been opposed to fire with the sentiments you have. The pipeline is serving your de facto reality, get over it. Going to be built by Canadians, a soshulist (moderation avoidance) group promoting in earnest all the alternatives in the world, social, industrial, medical…yet they are the ones dragging the tar sands, making masses of carbon, and now building the pipeline so you can drive around.

    What’s that smell?

  17. #17 by brewski on November 10, 2011 - 11:52 am

    “it is happening now, qed it will never change.”

    In this sentence “QED” makes no sense. I think you mean “ergo”.

  18. #18 by San Juan Bautista on November 10, 2011 - 12:19 pm

    I did not say it was never going to change, that is what you say. The point is it isn’t changing anytime soon. As soon as I see you living in a tent and riding a donkey (well after all you seem to be a democrat) we can deliver you from your hypocrisy.

    Don’t forget to turn out the light.

  19. #19 by Shane Smith on November 10, 2011 - 12:40 pm

    yes brewski, you do think that.

  20. #20 by Richard Warnick on November 10, 2011 - 1:25 pm

    A Democrat is someone not rich enough to own an elephant to ride on. ;-)

  21. #21 by San Juan Bautista on November 10, 2011 - 3:01 pm

    …But is content with a CO2 spewing car while pointing mercilessly at those who would fill their tanks. It’s a hoot!

  22. #22 by Richard Warnick on November 10, 2011 - 3:11 pm

    You know, if you’re independently wealthy in America you can have solar-powered everything. It wouldn’t take that much to make renewable-energy technology affordable for the American middle class. Yet it’s not happening, because the fossil fuels corporations have representation in Washington and the middle class doesn’t.

  23. #23 by brewski on November 10, 2011 - 3:27 pm

    Shane, you need to brush up on your Latin.

  24. #24 by Shane on November 10, 2011 - 4:03 pm

    Or, another possibility, you could think through the reasons it might be that I would suggest that the nameless one is simply restating what he set out to prove. One of them might explain the choice of saying “which is what (he) set out to prove” rather than “therefore”.

  25. #25 by brewski on November 10, 2011 - 4:17 pm

    Explain to me how “it is happening now, which was to be demonstrated it will never change” makes any sense.

    What a dolt.

  26. #26 by San Juan Bautista on November 10, 2011 - 4:39 pm

    For the record… “it is happening now, qed it will never change.” .. is something I never wrote or stated.

    I again ask Shane what he imagines will change given the truths of the energy matter.

    Richard, it is quite disingenuous to say solar can run our lives. There are nations far ahead of us, Germany namely, where the middle class have set up systems and it isn’t enough. This is why the Germans upon abandoning nuclear will be burning coal again. They are trying as quickly as possible to use renewables as much as they can, but the reality is..it isn’t enough yet.

    Richard do you really think in this economic climate the strapped middle class is going to drop 40k to put solar in their homes? Especially when all those homes are falling in value? Most can’t even buy a more efficient furnace let alone what you suggest. What do you want, government subsidies to revamp? The government cannot even meet its current obligations. How?

    After you see the 500 years of coal laying up here 100 ft thick, already providing, there is zero incentive to change here in the US. The rail lines are being rebuilt to accommodate the weight of massive coal trains, this is going on 24/7 over here in North Dakota and Wyoming, as well everywhere there is coal and oil energy. The fraud didn’t work, no is buying the AGW CO2 workup.

    So we live the pattern and see what comes of it.

  27. #27 by brewski on November 10, 2011 - 5:14 pm

    SJB,
    That is Shane’s favorite trick, is to intentionally misquote you and then explain how that phantom quote is stupid.
    That is why Shane is so dishonest and immoral.
    QED

  28. #28 by Larry Bergan on November 10, 2011 - 5:49 pm

    San Jaun/previously glenn:

    There’s only one thing you’ve ever promoted on this blog in every single comment you’ve ever made here:

    Give up because there’s no use trying.

    If we had started trying more then thirty years ago as many suggested, we would be looking pretty darn good right now where it comes to renewable energy. If America had started to lead back then even Germany would be better off by now.

    You said:

    Larry, the Ohio vote will be challenged in federal court, the civil war is on.

    Great! A civil war with 99% fighting on my side and billionaires giving their money away to become the 99% in a hurry. :)

  29. #29 by San Juan Bautista on November 10, 2011 - 6:02 pm

    That is your perspective, my job is advise idiots like yourself what they are up against, so at least you will have some chance of success at what you are trying. The point would be you need to know what to try at, those efforts with a chance of success..you tilt at windmills, (which by the way here cannot even put much of their power to the grid yet) I and others, have other plans.

    Germany is in it’s energy conundrum and will burn coal to get out of it. They are dumping nuclear.

    This is banner news, and peak oil does not mean anything once technology is applied to this reality.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/09/090910084259.htm

    About Ohio..Once the states have no money, and that is already the case, the whole collective bargaining meme will be moot. Can’t get blood from a stone… dead economy. Then government can be sized down to the point it can be drowned in the bath tub.

  30. #30 by Shane Smith on November 10, 2011 - 6:52 pm

    brewski :
    SJB,
    That is Shane’s favorite trick, is to intentionally misquote you and then explain how that phantom quote is stupid.
    That is why Shane is so dishonest and immoral.
    QED

    http://oneutah.org/this-blog/virtue-abortion-eudimonia/#comment-223107

  31. #31 by cav on November 10, 2011 - 7:38 pm

    I think states running out of money will NOT be a result of suitably rewarding public sector workers so much as it will be a nod to corporations who would exercise their not so subtle form of culturecide with their rabid distain of the masses. All this about drowning our government in the bathtub has only ever been about privatization and a naked tribute to Mammon.

    .

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