Andrew Sullivan Holds Back Tears Describing Obama’s Support of Same Sex Marriage

I disagree with some of his language; I agree with his assessment of the power of the President’s statement to glbt persons.

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  1. #1 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 8:20 am

    I’m sure that your typical republican numb skull will lable OBAMA as gay now, the republican party needs to die already

  2. #2 by Richard Warnick on May 14, 2012 - 9:51 am

    It’s worth bearing in mind that everything the American President says and does carries a lot of weight, especially when a precedent is set for good or ill.

    Good for President Obama that he now says he personally believes in marriage equality (the same position as Dick Cheney, interestingly enough).

    It’s bad that President Obama also refuses to prosecute anyone for torture, and continues the ever-expanding unconstitutional warrantless surveillance program. Basically the same as Dick Cheney on those issues, too.

  3. #3 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 10:02 am

    So you are telling us that Dick Cheney was on the ball concerning gay marriage long before the president? How can that be? Oh yeah, he has a lesbian daughter who supports him.

    How can Obama be defined as some hero for changing his mind at this late date? But for evangelicals and such that’s is about the only constituency that would oppose gay marriage. Why isn’t the glbt community showering Cheney with praise?

    It is taking away from the victory to fawn at the feet of this jonny cum lately president.

  4. #4 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 10:09 am

    OBAMA is a politician, not a liberal, a liberal dems would have been for equal rights for gay marriage from day one. And cheney is and his followers are pathetic excuses for human beings

  5. #5 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 10:17 am

    “Obama is a politician”. So what is your point?

    Cheney has personally supported gay marriage for years..Obama not so much. Don’t be in the dark, knight..could it be that the entire progressive agenda has been invested in the wrong man?

    You don’t know Cheney, nor do I, but he loves his daughter and wishes her the rights he has I’m sure. Less of a “politician” than Obama at least when it comes to this topic, something totally undeniable to all but the most committed “20%’ of hardcore Obama supporters.

    We had the Bush 20%, we’ll have the Obama 20%, seems to be a political law.

  6. #6 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 10:53 am

    I don’t think it’s being among the 20 die-hard % as much as the steering wheel is broken, the brakes needed servicing long ago, and all the vested players are scrambling to get their foot on the gas pedal.

    I’m just along for the ride – and throw in for a little gas money as I can.

  7. #7 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 11:07 am

    Never been any different, if you support Obama as a progressive in your heart after this, then you are the Obama 20%. The relationship is a lot like a being married to a wife beater, you continually hope for change and get shorted, sometimes whacked.

    This admin is like Tammany, declaring decrees at the behest of corporate handlers. This is a major side show to cover his disaster presidency, and it will work for the audience it was intended for. Sadly though the die is cast, the oligarchy abandons Obamaas becoming too big for his breeches, and as the reality of his non viability for re-election takes hold, the corporate owned media will crucify him up until the election.

    Really, to ask a political strategist if this helps Obama out…, not at all, it simply polarizes what was, his greatest skill as a politician, the great divider, as he certainly is no leader. In my opinion gay marriage just is not an issue important enough to decide a nation like America’s presidency, and saying you support it doesn’t change how people feel about it.

    His entire schtick has the stink of desperation upon it.

  8. #8 by brewski on May 14, 2012 - 11:12 am

    Titus,
    Apparently you did not get the memo that you are not allowed to criticize the first black president lest you be called a racist. The pro double standard lobby on OneUtah will come down on you like a tone of bricks if you don’t kiss the ring of Obama. Be forewarned.

  9. #9 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 11:17 am

    Since this site is a wholly owned subsidiary of the progressive movement, I am offering this public service to ground the troops of the movement and bring them a bit closer to reality so they can question their commitment and dig deeper to sustain our current impostor as president.

    I mean from what was touted as a Golden Era of progressivism under this turd is now this. He has killed the movement off very, very, well, and still has millions of the addled who would support him..but it won’t be enough.

    http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/gallup-state-numbers-predict-huge-obama-loss/352881

  10. #10 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 11:24 am

    Well Brewski, it’ll be a finger in the dike, so to speak. to sanction what those who disagree with Obama write. It isn’t so much a disagreement, but a matter of trust. Obama is not trustworthy, I am to think there is not a genuine bone in his body.

    Many are for what he pretends to represent, problem is he does what he’s told, we probably would too. Obama has handlers, limits his spiel can offer and the direction it can take.

    “Fascism is corporatism”. Benito Mussolini.

  11. #11 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 11:52 am

    titis v maybe your new here because your running your big mouth like you know me, first off everyone here knows I’m not a democrat, so why don’t you chill out on the assuming stuff when you don’t have a clue what your talking about!!

  12. #12 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 11:57 am

    My comments have nothing to do with you knight other than my observation of them. Are you an egomaniac? Good grief. No wonder you support the pres, he might be just like you.

  13. #13 by Richard Warnick on May 14, 2012 - 11:58 am

    President Obama is a shoo-in for re-election because this won’t be a referendum on the state of the economy, civil liberties or the rule of law. It will be a choice between a bad administration, and somebody who has offered to make things much worse.

  14. #14 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 11:58 am

    Know for sure knight, I am totally uninterested in how you perceive yourself.

  15. #15 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 12:00 pm

    Hhaah, you have to be kidding, and are truly out of the loop as to what is actually happening in flyover country.

  16. #16 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 12:00 pm

    brewski your tired lame republican ass kissing was comical to me at first now it’s simply pathetic! If you feel UTAH ONE is so unfair to conservatives then why keep posting your archie bunker rants?? You Tube seems like something more on your level and take titis v with you, your a match made in heaven ooopppss maybe further south

  17. #17 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 12:02 pm

    knight..once again your ego runs rampant..this site is not serious, and made for personal bullshit..

  18. #18 by Richard Warnick on May 14, 2012 - 12:03 pm

    Glenn Greenwald reminds us that Sullivan’s tears represent a reversal of the position he took just last week

    That’s from the same person who, to defend anti-gay-marriage Obama, has been writing things like: “this desperate desire among some gays for some kind of affirmation from one man is a little sad.“

    • #19 by Glenden Brown on May 14, 2012 - 12:24 pm

      Richard – Greenwald identified the problem I had with Sullivan’s language:

      Second, and much more important, it is wrong on every last level to relate to the President as a “father figure.” There was a time when I thought Sullivan’s serial blinding reverence for political leaders — Reagan and Thatcher, then Bush 43, now Obama — was the by-product of some sort of transferred British need to be subjects of a monarch. But I don’t think that theory explains much, since all kinds of native-born Americans do the same (remember all this and this?). I was supportive of Obama’s marriage announcement because of the political benefits it would engender, not because it gave me some kind of personal validation that my father has finally accepted who I am. The President is not Our Father; he’s a politician who, like all people wielding political power, is in great need of constant critical scrutiny and adversarial checks — from all citizens, but especially media figures. Relating to him as some kind of guiding paternalistic authority is, I’m sorry to say, really quite warped. But it’s far from uncommon, and that explains a lot.

      I think the President serves in several roles – political leader, head of state but also the role of a moral leader. Bush and Cheney’s moral leadership led to the acceptance of torture and the commission of war crimes. President Obama has failed to redress those moral failings. But in this area he has chosen to exercise moral leadership. It’s maybe not enough but it’s a good place to start.

  19. #20 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 12:08 pm

    titis v your simply a angry, uneducated, emotional child, the best way to handle a attention starved creature like you is simply ignore you, you haven’t said anything intelligent your just hurling insults with zero opinions of well thought out comments!! Your crude and boring!! Your the perfect You Tube creep goodbye………

  20. #21 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 12:15 pm

    Ok, I see in your egomaniacal way you are ignoring me very well knight. No anger here, though I sense you may a bit Constable Unstable over the prospects ahead.

    Here is my only comment to you… Don’t be in the dark, knight.

    Here is your reply, full of projection and little insecurity.

    “titis v your simply a angry, uneducated, emotional child, the best way to handle a attention starved creature like you is simply ignore you, you haven’t said anything intelligent your just hurling insults with zero opinions of well thought out comments!! Your crude and boring!! Your the perfect You Tube creep goodbye………”

    I’m sure you are used to it by now.

  21. #22 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 12:19 pm

    Is this the well thought commentary for which you desire to take credit?

    “I’m sure that your typical republican numb skull will lable OBAMA as gay now, the republican party needs to die already”.

    Yeah, I can see your point, it some high minded stuff, and more to the point on the top of your head.

  22. #23 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 12:35 pm

    Theres nothing funnier than the cowboy hillbilly republican, the loud mouth coward that runs their buck tooth nascar watch red face clown fux news logic! See these trailer trash john wayne wanna be’s get on websites talking tough guy crap when in real life these girly boys wouldn’t say a fraction of their tough guy tobacco spitting crap to anyones face. So they hide like rats behind the keyboard typing out insults with nothing important to contribute! titis v is your typical teenage internet goon, and has NOTHING to offer anyone I pitty this fool he needs attention are you happy now little titis? go milk a goat you hick!

  23. #24 by Vespasian on May 14, 2012 - 12:42 pm

    It is interesting point of history to see how a politically primitive populous always seeks to deify a political figure in a Kingly or Fatherly way. It is death of democracy to have such an attitude, but people are people, and this is what many people do everywhere.

    Usually the older the democracy the less worship of the individual we see, but for my money America was bonked on the head about 20 years ago and forgot itself during the Clinton years, and then went headlong into total amnesia, hence the president worship which I find very very dangerous.

    The president can’t be a moral leader with regard to all different moralities populating this country, what he should be is a supporter of Constitutional Republic as the thing that has made this nation’s greatness and afforded him his power…in fact he’s oath sworn to it and little else.

    It is the habit of tyranny to focus on Cults of Personality, and the soft side of an electorate is vulnerable when it comes to what qualifications other than charisma a president should have. We the people have been hugely shorted by this president and who he represents, and no amount of charisma can cover it up now.

  24. #25 by Richard Warnick on May 14, 2012 - 12:46 pm

    Wasn’t Sullivan one of those who kept insisting that Bush was “our commander-in-chief” when in fact the President only commands the military?

  25. #26 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 12:53 pm

    I guess the dark knight is losing his shit. You have been caught as an internet nothing dead to rights cowgirl.

    I thought you were ignoring…it’s going to be tough to take having those types decide the political life you are going to live should you stay in the US.

    Any who know this cowboy, knows that I will say, and do say whatever I want to whomever I want. One of those amendments to the Constitution has certainly emboldened citizens to speak up.

  26. #27 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 1:01 pm

    “The king is Dead, long live the King” !

    A metaphor for the schitzophrenic human race in political terms.

    I recommend reading Fromm’s book, “Escape from Freedom”, for some insight of why there are so many people who would give up their republican (inalienable) rights to be taken care of by a “motherly” or “fatherly” government.

    Freedom, as history provides, is a minority proposition.

  27. #28 by Vespasian on May 14, 2012 - 1:07 pm

    To the stiff necked people I advise, beware, there is empire afoot.

  28. #29 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 1:11 pm

    It’s a pleasure Titus V.

  29. #30 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 1:21 pm

    Our buck tooth hillbilly just can’t get enough! this backwards sheep molester can’t go three words without using profanity, it shows that then beings are raised in a cave they act crude, juvenile, fake macho mutant critters. You just make sure daisy you don’t leave the farm talking that smack! lol hillbilly

  30. #31 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 1:28 pm

    hey cav do you believe this titis v character? he makes brewski sound like a rhodes scholar! sorry brewski lol brewski I diagreed with many of your opinions but your classy enough not to use profanity to the voice your opinions.

  31. #32 by Vespasian on May 14, 2012 - 1:34 pm

    Belief? That is for the agnostic, the facts are irrefutable..just interested in gettin ‘er dun knight.

    I thought you were ignoring, speaking of goats, I must have gotten yours..now you cannot control yourself. Losing your shit is profanity, as is hoping other people would die already.

    Give it up, yer dun.

  32. #33 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 2:00 pm

    knight4444,

    While I do not agree with everthing TitusV or Vespasian attempt to convey, at least their ‘shrill’ is spelled correctly. And I believe our discussions go back much further than you might suspect.

    As far as where it’s all taking us – I refuse to speculate.

  33. #34 by brewski on May 14, 2012 - 2:01 pm

    “Theres nothing funnier than the cowboy hillbilly republican, the loud mouth coward that runs their buck tooth nascar watch red face clown fux news logic! See these trailer trash john wayne wanna be’s get on websites talking tough guy crap when in real life these girly boys wouldn’t say a fraction of their tough guy tobacco spitting crap to anyones face.”

    Knight, you make ad hominem classist posts like that and accuse me of being Archie Bunker? Ha!

  34. #35 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 2:07 pm

    I am cracking up, I have to admit. Double Ha!

  35. #36 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 2:22 pm

    Hey listen when some brainless hillbilly wants to play tough guy and start insulting people they know nothing about! I’m not having that! cav if I mispelled something what was it? and does it have anything to do with my point? NO listen if my hillbilly remarks offered anyone TOO BAD LOL brewski you need to be quiet your no peaceful sheep yourself. I should consider this web page is in Utah.

  36. #37 by Richard Warnick on May 14, 2012 - 3:03 pm

    Utah hillbillies don’t blog.

  37. #38 by knight4444 on May 14, 2012 - 3:24 pm

    LOL thats’funny!!! listen guys’I like to share opinions have a few laughs and thats it, But I’m not going to tolerate blind personal insults! if someone disagrees with me then feels a need to throw in a friendly insult it’s ok. But juvenile endless rants serve no purpose to me. Now cav Utahs ”I’ve wrote my one sentence for today now I need a nap” if your a champion of democratic ideas then stop! YOUR NOT QUALIFIED! LOL hey guys it’s been real, this is my last post ”stop celebrating” anyway take care guys

  38. #39 by Richard Warnick on May 14, 2012 - 3:36 pm

    GBCW

  39. #40 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 4:31 pm

    Knight4444,

    I don’t wish to belittle you (or you keyboarding anyway), but it occurs to me that a little more attention to some of these ‘details’ would enhance how your messages are received over all. You do have an appreciable ability to string witty curses together in a particularly ‘corn-pone’ way yourself and that, while sort of endearing, is wreaking havoc with your larger (tiny) points.

    We don’t all have to sound the same or have an equivalent focus or take on any issue or cluster of issues, and as both TitusV and any of the rest of us clearly indicate, we do not.

    To the issues – our messed-up economy, the product for the most part of the GOP, is not likely to be turned around by Willard. On the other hand, Obama’s responses to many of the roads-to-recovering have themselves been failures, wrong, or even nonexistent. That is not to say he’s done nothing good, but I have the feeling it’s nowhere near enough.

    Call me cranky!

  40. #41 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 4:43 pm

    Ps, you speak of naps as if they were a bad thing. Carve out a little nap-time and see if you don’t feel a little brighter.

    Richard, did yo have the good fortune to take that photo yourself? Nice.

  41. #42 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 4:44 pm

    Yo, I should talk about Knight!

  42. #43 by Richard Warnick on May 14, 2012 - 4:47 pm

    cav–

    Sorry, no, I hot-linked it off the Web. But the photog says it was taken in Utah.

  43. #44 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 4:47 pm

    Clueless pols come in all colors.

  44. #45 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 4:52 pm

    Sbeautiful.

    Is anyone besides me missing Knight.ooo4? I think he’s broken my heart, the way he talks about uTah.

    Must nap nao.

  45. #46 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 4:54 pm

    euTah

  46. #47 by Larry Bergan on May 14, 2012 - 6:20 pm

    We knew Richard would never cast an aspersion on a comment of his and post a picture of an alien goat. :)

    OneUtah probably wouldn’t exist without him.

  47. #48 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 7:33 pm

    Oh, and (unmasking my churlish, pedant self), in response to knight.004 comment # 36…I suppose I should even apologize in advance…er:

    misspell – What is more embarrassing than to misspell the name of the problem? Just remember that it is mis + spell and that will spell you the worry about spelling “misspell.”

    I’m checking out for now.

  48. #49 by Titus V. on May 14, 2012 - 7:42 pm

    Obama ears must be burning, as if to validate my opinion of him, he says this..http://news.yahoo.com/obama-jpmorgan-one-best-managed-banks-214359921–abc-news-politics.html

  49. #50 by cav on May 14, 2012 - 8:13 pm

    “This is one of the best managed banks.”

    Given the fact that JPMorgan just dumped, swindled, misplaced over two billion dollars, I’m kinda concerned that the other – not so well managed banks are doing.

    Rest assured the perp’s platinum parachutes will be more than enough punishment for such crimes.

  50. #51 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 7:58 am

    Richard..do you actually believe this?

    “President Obama is a shoo-in for re-election because this won’t be a referendum on the state of the economy”,

    It is about all the election is going to be about, that and the lack of jobs that can float a family. It is hard to apply the rules of politics for Obama supporters. The meme that the economy isn’t his fault isn’t going to matter to the broke and unemployed who have listened to Obama’s promises and have sunk even deeper as the clown approves banker and wall street bailouts.

    The deciding factor will be those men who voted for Obama last time out in mesmerization, they won’t do it again. Were there any gays who were not going to vote for Obama? Ok no gain there.
    The young? Totally suffering from delusion from this man.

    Wildcard? Women, and while the traditional thought is they will naturally flock to Obama, I don’t see this, the lustre has worn thin, and Obama has nothing but revenue collection plans and spending as a mantra.

    Common sense will make mince meat out of Obama, and Mitt will be able to pull it off. Of this I have no doubt. If you can get the people of Mass to elect you as a Mormon Mitt, then the nation will hav no problem with it.

    As a side note: Did you hear that the Catholic church is selling plenary indulgences again? Just in time to make Mormons look good!!

  51. #52 by cav on May 15, 2012 - 8:22 am

    The people of Massachusetts are going to play a big part in letting the buyer be aware. And while Obama can, at worst deliver only more of the same, he can suggest that problems developed over the course of eight bizarre years, policy installed during the previous administration, the barely 4 years since the fruition of which will take still longer to set straight. And he will be entirely correct – which is not to say He and His are the solution. But it is fair to say Willard and His are not likely to be either.

    I’m keeping my eye on the rest of the world with the hope that we’re still capable of learning something. Glass half full.

  52. #53 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 8:46 am

    Oh please, if you are Democrat supporter and invest in that mantra you are facing a good crushing in November. No one but the 20% say its bush’s fault anymore, and if you keep saying it, it begins to piss people off. So not the way.

    I however believe that Obama supporters are constitutionally unable to see it any other way, unable to see a way clear other than support a man who for all intents and purposes sold them down the river.

    No, the unwashed masses have their minds pretty made up from what I can see, and if this is the Obama strategy, any chance he has will wane down the campaign trail. This sets up the stage for Obama’s “Cartering”, which is better put as “Cratering”.

    Willard will know well what to do. Short government!! Have less of it..

    ..as for Mass. warning the country..of what? That Mitt installed Romenycare and now the State is screwed with massive health care insurance increases? I’m sure he’s not going to support that path natianlly after it helped get him un-elected in Mass and a polled majority will be very thankful to not have his learned disaster is Mass. be foisted on the rest of the nation.

  53. #54 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 8:52 am

    Titus (is that your real name?)–

    The Republicans want 2012 to be a referendum on the state of our economy, which I think is strange because everyone knows they wrecked the economy and have said NO to every attempt to repair it.

    I doubt that the Obama campaign is going to allow that to happen. This will be a “lesser of two evils” election, with Willard clearly the wrong choice. He has embraced the Ryan budget, called for de-funding Planned Parenthood, and has said in no uncertain terms to the middle class: “If you want help, vote for the other guy.” He stand for tax cuts for the rich, budget cuts for everyone else, and deficits forever. “If you don’t like my answer, you can vote for someone else,” he says.

    To women, Romney says: “Vote for the other guy.”

    To those who reject vulture capitalism, he says: “If people think there is something wrong with being successful in America then they better vote for the other guy because I’ve been extraordinarily successful.”

  54. #55 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 8:58 am

    8 years two wars 8 trillion in debt. 4 years 3 wars, thousands of personally ordered drone strikes. NDAA, gitmo, rendition, torture..all now run and supported by this president.

    What to say?

    NDAA alone has even ardent liberals throwing Obama under the bus. Did you see the Cusack video? Take heed..the crap mantra Democrats are leaning on has no root, the majority are not thinking your kind of thoughts. http://97.65.137.90/227280/video-ndaa-america-moves-towards-totalitarianism

    Listen to Carville!!

  55. #56 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 9:00 am

    8 years two wars 8 trillion in debt. 4 years 3 wars, hundreds of personally ordered drone strikes, 5 more trillion in debt. NDAA, gitmo, rendition, torture, bailouts..all now run and supported by this president.

    What to say?

    NDAA alone has even ardent liberals throwing Obama under the bus. Did you see the Cusack video? Take heed..the crap mantra Democrats are leaning on has no root, the majority are not thinking your kind of thoughts.

    http://97.65.137.90/227280/video-ndaa-america-moves-towards-totalitarianism

    Listen to Carville!!

  56. #57 by cav on May 15, 2012 - 9:11 am

    Carville slightly rewritten: It’s the stupid economy.

    The one Jamie Dimon actually runs.

  57. #58 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 9:11 am

    Willard said, “let Detroit go bankrupt.” Wrong answer.

    Willard has no foreign policy to speak of, but you know it won’t be any better with him in the White House. Anyway, only 4 percent of the voters care about foreign policy (CBS/NYT poll).

    I’m not voting for President Obama, I tend to vote third-party. But the Dems are counting on those voters (middle-class, women, minorities) Willard is rejecting by the millions, because most Americans think there are only two parties.

  58. #59 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 9:41 am

    Are you serious again? That isn’t enough, pulling bush’s policy out of the hat and claiming goody goody? Geeze us!! Nobody gives a whack about Detroit but for Union workers. It’s why Obama bailed it out.

    You guys are whistling past the graveyard, the middle class is done with Obama as a total fraud, if you don’t make jobs happen like you promised, you’re gone. Doesn’t matter if you think no one could have done better. The only people Obama has are the rich left, the dumb left, and the left out believers of hopey change.

    As long as you don’t vote for Obama, Willard will be the president. The fervor with which committed republicans will go to the polls will astound the democrats, not to mention voters who just flat hate Obama on the general principle that he is a commie, and surrounds himself with types who have no affiliations with the bulk of the American electorate.

  59. #60 by cav on May 15, 2012 - 9:48 am

    Tom Engelhardt writes (somewhat snarkishly I believe): “Here’s the essence of it: you can trust America’s creme de la creme, the most elevated, responsible people, no matter what weapons, what powers, you put in their hands. No need to constantly look over their shoulders.”

  60. #61 by cav on May 15, 2012 - 9:51 am

    And of course, the State leadership (those to whom we are preparing to cede it all to) is only a minimal notch below that.

    Those would be the Telestials, if I’m not mistaken.

  61. #62 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 9:56 am

    Think about what would have happened if the government didn’t take an ownership stake in GM and Chrysler. Suppliers would have gone down, too. Auto dealers across the country, out of business. Great Depression 2.0.

    What Detroit’s Resurgence Says About The Auto Bailout

    The union members gave up benefits and pay to keep their jobs. What did Wall Street billionaires give up in exchange for government help?

    What can Republicans offer to the 99 Percent? They are all about the 1 Percent.

    I can vote for Rocky Anderson because Utah will go for Willard by a landslide no matter what. But voting third-party helps build an alternative to the two corporate parties.

    Obama = commie? If only. I seem to recall he signed an extension of the Bush Tax Cuts For The Rich. With socialists like that, who needs capitalists?

  62. #63 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 12:42 pm

    The Opels of GM of Europe would still be built whether GM survived or not, and all the SUV’s and pieces of shit still built here in North America would be Fords. We gained nothing but a debt with company who brought itself to its knees building crappy vehicles.

    We just diversified failure is what we did!

  63. #64 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 12:46 pm

    By “failure,” you of course mean the world’s largest automobile manufacturer.

    How’s the weather in Opposite Land?

  64. #65 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 12:46 pm

    Richard I understand that you don’t want to live in the world of perception but that is what many watchers of obama think of him. He’s a naked commie by any standard and your polls and complications are not going to change anyone’s mind.

    The government takeover of GM is like the Soviets forcing everyone to buy a Trabant.

  65. #66 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 12:47 pm

    Communism for People, Dachas for the Party elite!! Yaay!!

  66. #67 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 12:51 pm

    The largest flat broke failed manufacturer of cars in the world. The only thing they could realistically sell is made in Germany by Opel.

    if it wasn’t a total failure it wouldn’t need to be bailed out. Did Ford take the money? We are now going to have at least 2 more decades with large engined General Messes of Crap (GMC) vehicles befouling our skies and roads.

    So worth it!!

  67. #68 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 12:52 pm

    Can you back up anything you say? For example, calling the President of the United States “a naked commie by any standard.” For example, what standard?

    You can’t be Victoria Jackson and make any claim to sanity. “Only Glenn Beck understands me.” ;-)

  68. #69 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 12:57 pm

    Richard you overlook that GM is the supplier of vehicles to the fascist military state, and that American citizens are compelled to buy them in a no bid scenario, GM having a government monopoly.

    No hesitation that this company now bailed out is no more than a government subsidized company with guaranteed money, very much like Boeing? I’m surprised we haven’t had complaints to the WTO for the subsidies, but I’m sure we will in time.

  69. #70 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 12:57 pm

    You can try and blame GM for Bush’s Great Recession, but you know, that’s not reality. Bush is to blame, and the auto industry got hurt along with the middle class. I can’t understand why anyone would vote Republican ever again after the Bush administration.

    Funny, when I bought my Toyota nobody informed me I was required to get a GM car. As for the military, tanks are built in a U.S. government-owned plant managed by Chrysler. MRAPs are the mainstay of the war effort in Afghanistan, and GM doesn’t build those either. So what the hell are you talking about?

  70. #71 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 1:05 pm

    He wants to have the government run heath care, a socialist/communist prospect.

    The government now has a hand in decisions of the largest car maker on earth, he is deficit spending and granting monies to pet projects and crony friends. The first part is naked communism of the variety the public by coercion are forced to swallow. The second is the nature of a socialist corporation, the government having a hand in financing and decisions, and cronies and suck ups reaping the dividends. So common in an oligarchy state of which communism falls to. His ideology is communist, but no way he can work it through openly while president.

    Back it up? Like the disaster economy isn’t enough to convince you?

    Obama at heart is a communist, what he is forced to do in America at the current time is not much what he would like to do. He isn’t going to get anymore chances.

  71. #72 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 1:09 pm

    Are you serious again? GM pieces of crap are the main standard for almost all government transport. Get your head out of your tank and look around.

  72. #73 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 1:09 pm

    Why is my previous post moderated?

  73. #74 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 2:05 pm

    For some reason the spam filter picks up on the word “socialist.” Some One Utah commentators change the spelling to avoid having comments go to moderation.

    On the substance of your comment, the Heritage Foundation invented the private health insurance mandate and stalwart righties such as Senator Orrin Hatch championed the mandate for many years.

    You can’t all of a sudden declare this policy “government-run health care.” That’s a Frank Luntz bogus talking point. The truth: the mandate is a corporate takeover of government, making us buy a product we don’t want.

    The private sector of the economy is doing great. Corporate profits are at an all-time high. The stock market has been going up and up. And more than 600,000 public sector employees have lost their jobs. If this is “communism” according to you, tell me what dictionary you are using. ;-)

  74. #75 by Titus V. on May 15, 2012 - 4:29 pm

    haha, politics is about making words work for you, that government run health care name will stick like glue. the limits of the electorates knowledge serves the oligarchy well.

    I said Obama was the communist, he can’t do what wishes here, he’s tried, but let’s face it, he has failed.

    Unfortunately the stock market doesn’t help anyone that is not in it, and corporate profits are going up as markets grow overseas for international corporations. Doesn’t much help Americans. Just ask ‘em.

    4 dollar gas, lost homes, wars, it won;t be easy for obama, he gets the blame, and the electorates mindset is already that no matter what, he isn’t doing whatever he wants to do well enough, or fast enough..impatient lot Americans.

  75. #76 by Richard Warnick on May 15, 2012 - 5:41 pm

    So you admit “government-run health care” is a lie in the context of the so-called Affordable Care Act, yet at the same time you subscribe to it.

    You decry “communism” (by whatever definition) yet go on to complain that the stock market only benefits the rich. Well, duh.

    $4 gas and TWO stupid wars didn’t keep Bush from getting re-elected. The foreclosure crisis continues, with no prosecutions of obvious fraud.

    But where is the difference between the two major parties here? If McCain or Romney were President right now it might be the same or worse. The “blame Obama” contingent is made up of people who never voted for him in the first place.

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