Welfare Beats Working? Not Even in a Depressed Economy

The Cato Institute is once again peddling the myth that government assistance to low-income Americans IS TOO GENEROUS and it discourages them from working (“keeps them in poverty” as right-wingers love to claim, with false empathy).

Their method of analysis was debunked long ago by the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities.

Not only does Cato count certain benefits as income when the typical AFDC family does not receive them, but Cato also exaggerates the average benefit levels these programs provide.

By overstating the benefits and ignoring means-testing, right-wing ideologues are able to conclude that welfare beats working for a living at a low-wage job. If this were true, the logical next step would be to increase wages – but instead the right-wingers demand a reduction in public assistance.

  1. #1 by Larry Bergan on August 20, 2013 - 6:55 pm

    Sounded like Neil Cavuto had a cold or had been breathing the bad air all around us.

    Whenever you see the words: institute, foundation, family, Americans, freedom, tax reform and other words – I’m sure I missed some – attached to an organization, you should question the context of every thing that organization tells you.

    I haven’t been commenting much lately, because my computer has been seriously attacked by somebody I would like to see hanged after a legitimate trial unlike anything Bradley Manning got. 🙁

    Happens about once a year, and I’m really pissed!

  2. #2 by cav on August 20, 2013 - 7:09 pm

    Have a beer. Chill. You’re totally going emoprog.

  3. #3 by Larry Bergan on August 20, 2013 - 7:12 pm

    My telephone company provides me with “Norton” – picture Jackie Gleason – ,but somehow the bastards got through again.

    I’m struggling NOT to start over from scratch – for about the 5th time – on my hard drive, because my operating system is about 10 years old and I would have to go through months of updates to XP.

    My computer can’t run anything else, because I don’t have enough memory capacity.

    Should have been a libertarian!

    • #4 by Richard Warnick on August 21, 2013 - 10:13 am

      FYI Microsoft stopped selling Windows XP in June 2008, to the annoyance of customers who hated Vista. Support for XP will end in April 2014.

      The latest from Microsoft is Windows 8 (and 8.1). Time to buy a new computer. 🙁

      • #5 by Larry Bergan on August 22, 2013 - 12:16 am


        If Bill Gates would get out of the voting machine business, I could forgive him for abandoning an old operating system.

        Hand-mark, hand count!

  4. #6 by Larry Bergan on August 20, 2013 - 7:57 pm


    It’s not easy living in Obamaburg. I had hoped for more.

  5. #7 by cav on August 20, 2013 - 8:00 pm

    You’re not alone there. Good luck sorting the software packet from the new government sponsored ‘improvements’.

    Disclaimer: I am not a computer person. At all.

    Maybe this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BU9WmcAa5So

    will brighten your day (sorry to be off topic, but irking brewski can always wait til tomorrow).

  6. #8 by Larry Bergan on August 20, 2013 - 8:47 pm


    Why would anybody watch television when they can watch YouTube?


    Not everybody can afford YouTube.

    Great video though:

  7. #9 by brewski on August 20, 2013 - 8:54 pm

    “the logical next step would be to increase wages”
    How do you do that? By imperial fiat?
    If that works then why doesn’t Cuba just pay everyone 10 times as much and then the whole country would be affluent. It is so easy. I can’t imagine why they just don’t do it.

    I have received many job applications from people who have told me in so many words “I don’t really want the job, I am just applying so I can say that I applied so I can keep collecting unemployment benefits”.

    So I am sorry that your conclusion is based in total myth.

    • #10 by Richard Warnick on August 21, 2013 - 10:25 am

      So you agree with the right-wingers that the problem is the social safety net is too generous?

      Have you been on unemployment in Utah? You are required to apply to four jobs a week. These jobs must be in the exact same specialty as your previous job. Job openings are so scarce now that inevitably you have to apply to employers thousands of miles away just to meet the requirement.

  8. #11 by brewski on August 20, 2013 - 10:04 pm

  9. #12 by Larry Bergan on August 20, 2013 - 10:14 pm


    I’m not saying that people who annoy employers by filling out applications while never intending to work for them doesn’t happen, but what about billionaires who’s children’s children’s children will never have to work a day in their lives, and will never have to show up, multiple times a day, to fill out a single application?

    I am 61 years old, and I abhorred filling out applications for a job that I never got when I was over 55. I would have given anything to get a miserable, minimum wage, job and I eventually got one. I’ve been there for over 6 years.

    • #13 by brewski on August 21, 2013 - 8:27 am

      “but what about billionaires who’s children’s children’s children will never have to work a day in their lives, and will never have to show up, multiple times a day, to fill out a single application?”

      Who cares?

  10. #14 by cav on August 20, 2013 - 10:33 pm

    brewski, this guy did make a seemingly cogent argument. And his demeanor, as serious as any of the ‘Founding Fathers’. But I reject the purity, correctness and mainstream republicanism he bundled into some shiny political party on a heap of bullshit.

    Our memories are short, but not that short.

    Besides, so very much of the troubles we must face are the result of the very Class-ism he suggests will disappear if we only vote PNAC / Koch in ’16.

    Again, where are the jawbs bills the Jawb Kreatorz assured us would be in the tube after the 2010 election? We just spent a week tearing down a press to raise minimum wages for burger-flippers…How does the Noble Elbert, Prince of the conservatives, rectify all of this?


    • #15 by brewski on August 21, 2013 - 8:33 am

      “where are the jawbs bills”

      Bills don’t “create” jobs. Asking for a jobs bill is lik asking for a rain bill.

      The single best thing we can do to help boost our economy is to remove the disincentives for hiring in the US. Tax simplification, removal of all payroll taxes, end employer costs and obligations for the sin of hiring someone. And, yes, that would mean ending Obamacare and replacing it with Canadian style single-payer health insurance. Call me a right-winger.

      • #16 by Richard Warnick on August 21, 2013 - 10:40 am

        Certainly the Recovery Act didn’t create enough jobs. Because at the insistence of Republicans the Act prohibited the federal government from hiring anybody. Then the Republicans voted against it anyway.

        • #17 by brewski on August 21, 2013 - 11:55 am

          Hiring Federal Employees is not the way to create jobs, if in fact jobs can be “created” at all.

          Why don’t we just have the Federal Government hire everyone who wants a job and we can create instant wealth? Look how well that has worked for North Korea.


          • #18 by Richard Warnick on August 21, 2013 - 1:06 pm

            Ever hear of the CCC, or the WPA?

            Most of the infrastructure they built in Utah, such as national forest roads and buildings, is still in use 80 years later.

  11. #19 by cav on August 21, 2013 - 8:14 am

    Well then. Not only did the Bush administration do nothing to protect consumers, it embarked on an aggressive and unprecedented campaign to prevent states from protecting their residents from the very problems to which the federal government was turning a blind eye. . . . The administration accomplished this feat through an obscure federal agency called the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency (OCC). . . . In 2003, during the height of the predatory lending crisis, the OCC invoked a clause from the 1863 National Bank Act to issue formal opinions preempting all state predatory lending laws, thereby rendering them inoperative.

    Enter the housing crash!

    That’s just one among many. Some so heinous many of us are still in denial.

    • #20 by brewski on August 21, 2013 - 8:35 am

      Source please. I’d like to read about this. Thank you.

  12. #21 by cav on August 21, 2013 - 8:34 am

    President Bush (R, lest we forget) secretly instructed the NSA to wiretap Americans’ domestic communications with international parties without seeking a FISA warrant or congressional approval.

    One could go on and on and on.

    Needless to say, salvation, let alone good government, won’t be brought to us in the offerings of the Republicans.

  13. #22 by cav on August 21, 2013 - 8:44 am

    • #23 by brewski on August 21, 2013 - 11:57 am

      Please tell me you can do better than that.

  14. #28 by cav on August 21, 2013 - 9:15 am

    History is such a wonderful thing.

    Never elected, Republican president Gerald Ford was part of a wonderful deal that began with his official acceptance of the Warren Commission report in 1964. He was rewarded by replacing Agnew as VP in ’73, and when Nixon resigned, Ford became President. He completed his end of the bargain with his pardon of Nixon and was then given a token spot on the 1976 ballot when the election was over before it began (a bit like Romney’s reward in 2012 when it was clear the Republicans could not win).

    During his brief time as President he “chose” a certain George H. W. Bush to head the CIA, ostensibly because Bush was a “fresh face” who would clean up the organization. It was well known in Washington, DC circles that Bush had been deeply involved in CIA operations for a number of years.

    In 1975, he asked Congress for another $722 million for Vietnam, claiming it would win the war…the Vietnamese drove us out a couple weeks later.

    The Repubs do have so much to offer – sadly, so little of it is good for the country.

    • #29 by Larry Bergan on August 21, 2013 - 11:55 pm


      You shouldn’t beat up on Gerald. He was such a pleasant guy. 🙂

  15. #30 by cav on August 21, 2013 - 10:10 am

    Whenever i want to be distracted from global warming and financial meltdown and the NSA etc, etc, I can always think about Fukushima.

  16. #31 by cav on August 21, 2013 - 4:31 pm

    Obama DOJ Asks Court to Grant Immunity to George W. Bush For Iraq War :


    But will torture, convict a Spec4 for violating secrecy.

    Oh, and did I mention Fukashima?

  17. #33 by cav on August 21, 2013 - 8:50 pm

    They were probably made immune during the ‘W’ years.

    The records will be de-Classified in the year 2053.

  18. #34 by Larry Bergan on August 21, 2013 - 11:14 pm

    I’ve been wasting my time, trying to fix my computer – AGAIN -, but I’m happy to see that OneUtah still has some pretty darn good discussions.

    Keep it up, all!

  19. #35 by Larry Bergan on August 21, 2013 - 11:21 pm

    I keep getting an icon that pops up at the lower right of my screen, telling me that my firewall is disabled. When I click on it, I find that my firewall is turned on.

    Today, when I got home from work, I found about 10 programs that got introduced into every browser I have, slowing them down to speeds that would drive anybody crazy.

    I still don’t know how to turn my firewall on.

  20. #36 by cav on August 26, 2013 - 7:29 pm

    Another American war in the Middle East? That will fix the unemployment problem just like it did in 2003,5,8,10,11,12!

    Learning? Nahgonnahapn.

  21. #37 by Larry Bergan on August 26, 2013 - 8:43 pm

    I wonder Syria got their chemical weapons. From Rumsfeld? I sorry but It’s impossible for me not to be jaded against the war machine.

  22. #38 by Disgusted jew on September 1, 2013 - 11:39 am

    It’s awfully quiet in progressive brainwashland these few days…feeling like a used condom much?

    Is it finally sinking in you Knotheads?

    • #39 by Larry Bergan on September 2, 2013 - 4:36 pm


      I’m in between software right now, and it’s time consuming.

      Try to cheer up.

      • #40 by cav on September 2, 2013 - 5:18 pm

        “Between Software” sounds like it might be kinda nice!

      • #41 by Larry Bergan on September 2, 2013 - 8:20 pm

        It’s not nice, but I’ve seen worse.

  23. #42 by Disgusted jew on September 1, 2013 - 1:06 pm

    wonder if he threw a tantrum just like he does every time he doesn’t get his way…like an undisciplined 3 year old. Wonder if Moochelle made him a Bosco chocolate drink to calm him..

    Naw, I doubt it, she’s a fuckin’ bitch..


  24. #43 by Disgusted jew on September 2, 2013 - 6:03 pm

    Stop saying stoopid things Larry to cover your ass, maybe you can earn forgiveness…you voted for the fuckin’ nazi TWICE!!

    It’s only stoopidity on your part…but if you continue along WILLFULLY, that will be EVIL!

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