Posts Tagged prop 8
I am short on time right now so I’ll refer readers to Ari Ezra Waldman’s excellent piece at Towleroad.
The general consensus seems to be that the court rendered a relatively narrow verdict. My instincts tell me, however, that even if the sole effect is to strike down Prop 8 and allow same sex couples to marry in California, it’s still a big deal. The nation’s most populous state, what happens in California will effect other states and the Federal government. Read the rest of this entry »
If you love, where you love, what equipment you might use… Actually, the equipment is somebody’s business. And yet, the “Traditional Values” people are all upset over homosexuality in the movies, in the workplace, in the Boy Scouts. And they should just realize that homosexuality in the Boy Scouts is a tradition. And now that the California State Supreme Court has upheld Prop 8, it’s official: San Francisco is moving to Iowa.
The California Supreme Court has issued its decision on Prop 8. The proposition has been upheld, but existing gay marriages will stand. I’ll update when more details are available. It’s impossible to connect to the court’s website right now.
UPDATE: It appears that the court has determined that Prop 8 is not a ‘revision’ to the California constitution, but simply an amendment. Read the rest of this entry »
The long-anticipated ruling on Prop 8 will be issued on Tuesday. Of course, this won’t put the issue to rest for either side, but it will be another step in the path.
The California Supreme Court has announced that it will issue an opinion in three cases challenging the constitutionality of Proposition 8 at 10 a.m. on Tuesday, May 26, 2009. (Strauss v. Horton, S168047; Tyler v. State of California, S168066; City and County of San Francisco v. Horton, S168078.) Tuesday at 10 a.m., the opinion will be available on the California Courts Web site at this link.
And for desert.
The California Supreme Court finds itself center stage tomorrow when it will hear oral arguments on whether it should uphold Proposition 8’s ban on same-sex marriage.
The case touches the heart of our democracy and poses a profound question: can a bare majority of voters strip away an inalienable right through the initiative process? If so, what possible meaning does the word inalienable have?
The state faced a dilemma like this before. In 1964, 65 percent of California voters approved Proposition 14, which would have legalized racial discrimination in the selling or renting of housing. Both the California and U.S. Supreme Courts struck down this proposition, concluding that it amounted to an unconstitutional denial of rights. read on…
The religious right must make a choice; to sacrifice the very principles insures them their freedom to worship in favor of making some sort of point about their interpretation of doctrine OR to hold inalienable rights of all humans about institutionalized, politicized bigotry.
With their support for Proposition 8 the Mormons have more or less done what someone might do who — in an incredibly dumb moment — decides to call up the local IRS office and start asking the kind of questions that inevitably leads to getting audited.
Frank Schaeffer has an opinion piece on Huffington Post entitled Perspectives on Marriage: Score 1 For Gay America — 0 To The Mormons. I think it would help for Mormons to read this article–with an open mind–just for the purpose of understanding how the rest of the world views them.
I happen to have just been thinking about how Mormons make a big deal about celebrity Mormons (athletes, movie stars, professional singers, etc.), and how they probably do that because it makes them feel more normal and mainstream. But it’s delusional. As Frank says,
It seems that the Mormons have begun to believe their own propaganda when it comes to seeing themselves as “just another” evangelical group. They aren’t.
The evangelicals may be plenty crazy, as they have manifested themselves to be through the late great Religious Right (that is now crashing in flames following the Obama victory), but the Mormons are exponentially crazier when it comes to marriage, and gender roles. [snip]
New religions, where their founders are not shrouded by the merciful mists of time — for instance L. Ron Hubbard of the Scientologists or Joseph Smith, founder of the Mormons — seem stranger than the founders of older religions. Maybe that’s unfair, but there it is. That is because the newcomers lived recently enough so that truth claims and character are easier to check out.
Here is just two of many quaint bits of Mormon “teaching” ( this first on race is no longer the official position of the church, but still…)
“And if any man mingles his seed with the seed of Cane [i.e black people] the only way he could get rid of it or have salvation would be to come forward & have his head cut off & spill his blood upon the ground. It would also take the life of his Children.”
(Wilford Woodruff’s Journal, 1852, Brigham Young’s address before the legislative assembly of the Territory of Utah upon slavery)
“Nearly all the great discoveries of man in the last half century have, in one way or another, either directly or indirectly, contributed to prove Joseph Smith to be a Prophet… I know that he said the moon was inhabited by men and women the same as this earth, and that they lived to be a greater age than we do, that they lived generally to near the age of 1000 years. He described the men as averaging near six feet in height, and dressing quite uniformly in something near the Quaker style. In my Patriarchal blessing, given by the father of Joseph the Prophet, in Kirtland, 1837, I was told that I should preach the gospel to the inhabitants of the sea — to the inhabitants of the moon, even the planet you can now behold with your eyes.”
(Oliver B. Huntington, Young Woman’s Journal, Vol. 3, p. 263-264)
So, okay, enough already of the “seed of Cain,” moon men, on to marriage, California’s Proposition 8 and the Mormons…
As most in this community know, that’s just the tip of the iceberg of crazy Mormon quotes. But Frank’s entire piece is a pretty interesting read as he quotes a church histories who tallies up Joseph Smith’s wives by age and shows that “The teenage representation is the largest, though the twenty-year and thirty-year groups are comparable, which contradicts the Mormon folk-wisdom that sees the beginnings of polygamy was an attempt to care for older, unattached women. These data suggest that sexual attraction was an important part of the motivation for Smith’s polygamy.”
. . . for the Mormons to grandstand on marriage is just nuts, given their history and beliefs.
I don’t care one way or the other whether Mormons ever become mainstream. But I do care when they meddle in the rights of others in order to promote their own agenda. I think this time the widespread attention to Prop. 8 will be a net negative for the church’s purposes. And Mormons will eventually come to understand that, and being the survivors they are, will make adjustments.
KSL tells us that
A group that supports the stand The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints took on California’s Proposition 8 took out a full-page ad in today’s New York Times.
The Becket Fund for Religious Liberty placed the ad, which is titled “No Mob Veto.” [snip]
The ad says what began as “demonstrations” against the Church have gotten out of hand. It goes on to say, “Religious wars are wrong; they are also dangerous. Those who fail to condemn or seem to condone that intimidation are at fault as well.” [snip]
The Church says the ad, which is signed by scholars, dignitaries, and religious leaders from a variety of faiths, comes at a time when the right of free expression of people of faith has come under attack.
So who is the Beckett Fund? They have a web site, but good luck finding any actual information about the people behind them. The web site is conspicuously lacking names. I checked out the ad and found exactly thirteen names of “scholars, dignitaries, and religious leaders” (see below) and found the church failed to mention at least one convicted criminal in the person of Watergate Seven scoundrel Chuck Colson (I know I’m going to hear about all the good things he’s done since prison — still.)
Well, we all want to say hurray for our side. But the Becket Fund is just another conservative think tank focused on religious issues that they happen to approve of. They filed an amicus brief supporting Pleasant Grove City in the Supreme Court case involving the small religious group Summum.
This is not to say Beckett’s support is not helpful to the Mormon church, but it’s important to keep in perspective who they are and the scope of their mission. Their NoMobVeto site is under construction but they do have a page soliciting contributions and stating that “All contributions to The Becket Fund, a 501(c)(3) organization, are tax-deductible to the fullest extent of the law.” Methinks maybe Beckett sees an opportunity to tap into the millions of dollars church members will surely willingly donate to this cause, especially now that the Mormon church has embraced Beckett.
The Mormon church seems puzzled by negative public reactions to their support for Prop 8 and other anti-gay laws. Their follow-up statements urge love and understanding while failing to understand that their own actions promote hate and discrimination.
Mormons are a powerful voting block and can generally be counted on to get behind the church’s position–whatever it is. Members take literally the call to support the brethren in every word. However, there are some who dare to say the church is wrong on this issue, and they are putting their own membership on the line — even leaving the church as a result.
Lisa Derrick at FireDogLake tells us Mormons Losing Members Over Anti-Gay Campaigns
While the Mormon Church hierarchy was responsible for organizing millions of dollars and thousands of hours of manpower to pass California’s Proposition 8 and Arizona’s Prop 102, the church’s tactics haven’t sat so well with some of its members–including families, members with Mormon heritage going back 150 years, and gay members—who began speaking out in July on the website signingforsomething.org.
Since July almost six hundred LDS Church members have expressed their disapproval and/or resigned. In October a copy of the site’s petition and emails were delivered to the Mormon Church headquarters, but the site is still accepting signatures and letters, since this is an issue that won’t go away.
A visit to the SigningForSomething web site reveals passionate and sincere expressions from members who sadly are leaving their faith. Here’s an example:
This issue has pretty much torn me apart. I have been so saddened by the Church’s involvement with this Proposition. . . . I cannot understand how they would think it even remotely okay to interfere with the civil rights of other citizens.
Of course, with some 8 million members, what’s the big deal about some 600? I think the big deal is that those are only the ones who are willing to state publicly what they feel in their hearts. There are many more who are hurting for their own family and friends who are being discriminated against by the church’s actions, but who are fearful of saying so publicly. It provides such an internal conflict for them as they truly are devoted to their faith, but they also believe the church is wrong on this issue.
As for the church’s puzzlement over its fair exercise of free speech and participation in the process, perhaps I can help them to understand. They hold tremendous power in their ability to organize grassroots activity and to raise huge sums of money. When the church calls, the membership responds en masse. While other churches may hold the same political opinions, no other church has anything close to the Mormon machinery needed to have a real political impact.
Those both inside and outside the church look with dismay at the way the church has wielded its power particularly in California’s Prop 8. It’s not a fair fight and so far Goliath has managed to step on the rights of David. Time will tell whether that power play will win out in the end. With rights at stake, even Goliath can be felled.
Dan Savage Takes On Tony Perkins Over Prop 8
You don’t get to march in the public square, slime people, malign people and demagogue against people and then jump behind a bush and say, no God we’re a church.
The Mormon Church has politicized itself with this movement and — in California to ban same-sex marriage. And it wasn’t just the Mormon Church encouraged its followers. The first prophet of the Mormon Church had a letter read from every temple, every Mormon temple in the land instructing its members as a religious duty to donate time and money to this campaign. You cannot campaign against the vulnerable minority group in this country in the political arena without expecting some sort of response
I leave you with a criminally stupid quote from one of our otherwise brilliant OneUtah authors (we really are an open forum)
“Gay marriage leaves men, women and especially children handicapped in the sort of personal development a truly progressive civilization requires.” – PAUL MERO is president of the Sutherland Institute, a conservative think tank.
Colbert actually supports the LDS Church position! (and he really ripped into some gay guy too and he was pretty serious).
He also made Ken’s argument for why 70% of African Americans voted for Prop 8.
I think he’s gonna get in trouble Colbert. Yes I do.
Tuesday November 11, 2008
Proposition 8 Protests – Dan Savage
Dan Savage explains that those who voted for Proposition 8 most overwhelmingly were old people.
Video at Crooks and Liars (just in case The comedy Channel Takes it Down).